Wake Turbulence...[i]there[/i].

Have a question regarding commercial aviation? Get an answer from a real airline pilot!

Moderators: el, ZeroAltitude, flyboy2548m

User avatar
3WE
Posts: 4135
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 2:37 pm
Location: Flyover, America

Wake Turbulence...[i]there[/i].

Postby 3WE » Tue Jan 03, 2017 4:20 pm

http://forums.jetphotos.net/showthread. ... ncy-at-AMS

Bobbieee agrees 110% that the aircraft should have gone around due to wake turbulence.

I am not sure I see good, clear evidence of wake turbulence here...My 172 AND 32A experience is that it's generally more of a sudden jolt, and I see very little evidence of the proverbial 'uncommand roll'...I guess if there were some tailwinds the wake could have planted the second plane firmly (as the video appears to show).

Plus, one of my 3BS general rules of thumb, is that an aircraft can generally handle wake turbulence 'from it's own kind' (within common sense, of course).

AND, you have to have pretty special winds to encounter wake turbulence on a final approach course, since it settles BELOW the flight path and you have to have a fairly precise light crosswind + tailwind to bring one of the vortexes to the centerline...AND the 'normal headwind' moves the wake even further 'below' the next aircraft...

Bottom line, 3BS thinks there's a decent dose of 3BS-like (but not_3BS's) BS floating around here.


I do concur that it looks like the second plane touched down before the first plane vacated the runway, and I find that pretty unusual and in violation of 'normal operating rules'.
Commercial Pilot, Vandelay Industries, Inc., Plant Nutrient Division.

User avatar
flyboy2548m
Posts: 3759
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:32 am
Location: Ormond Beach, FL

Re: Wake Turbulence...[i]there[/i].

Postby flyboy2548m » Tue Jan 03, 2017 4:35 pm

Is there a question there somewhere?
Chief Pilot/ACJ Program Manager, Vandelay Industries, Inc

User avatar
3WE
Posts: 4135
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 2:37 pm
Location: Flyover, America

Re: Wake Turbulence...[i]there[/i].

Postby 3WE » Tue Jan 03, 2017 5:09 pm

flyboy2548m wrote:Is there a question there somewhere?


Apologies:

Are Boeing Bobby and Evan incorrect in stating that "The second 747 should have gone around to avoid wake turbulence"?

OR (inferred) Is 3BS basically correct in his bottom line comment in the original post...that 'needing to go around' in the featured incident is largely BS?
Commercial Pilot, Vandelay Industries, Inc., Plant Nutrient Division.

User avatar
flyboy2548m
Posts: 3759
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:32 am
Location: Ormond Beach, FL

Re: Wake Turbulence...[i]there[/i].

Postby flyboy2548m » Tue Jan 03, 2017 11:20 pm

Couple of issues here. I, for one, am not convinced that the second airplane's hard landing was necessarily due to wake turbulence. Looked more like a garden-variety pranger, which happens all the time without the benefit of wake turbulence. In fact, it may be the second crew was tracking a bit high to avoid the wake, and then dove down to the runway. Not knowing EASA separation rules, I can't say if the sequencing was "legal", but it does look sloppy.
Chief Pilot/ACJ Program Manager, Vandelay Industries, Inc

User avatar
3WE
Posts: 4135
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 2:37 pm
Location: Flyover, America

Re: Wake Turbulence...[i]there[/i].

Postby 3WE » Tue Jan 03, 2017 11:55 pm

flyboy2548m wrote:...I, for two, am not convinced that the second airplane's hard landing was necessarily due to wake turbulence. Looked more like a garden-variety pranger, which happens all the time without the benefit of wake turbulence...


Ha! Flyboy Concurs with me.

Blind Squirrels and Parlour-Talking Ass Hats sometimes get the right answer or find nuts, respectively.
Commercial Pilot, Vandelay Industries, Inc., Plant Nutrient Division.

User avatar
3WE
Posts: 4135
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2008 2:37 pm
Location: Flyover, America

Re: Wake Turbulence...[i]there[/i].

Postby 3WE » Fri Jan 06, 2017 3:36 pm

Ironingly, here's another 'double runway occupancy incident'...I would expect that the winds here would minimize the chance of a wake encounter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=erttyI7WOKo
Commercial Pilot, Vandelay Industries, Inc., Plant Nutrient Division.


Return to “Airline Pilot Q&A”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest