Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

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PurduePilot
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Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby PurduePilot » Mon Dec 13, 2010 3:37 am

http://www.studentpilot.com/interact/fo ... n-a-Cirrus

I have to say I was surprised when the CFI said his immediate reaction was to reach for the chute.
Unintentional spin...in a Cirrus

I’m a CFI-I who instructs in a SR20 full-time. I have a challenging
low-time Private Pilot student who is rough and impulsive on the controls.
In stalls, when a wing drops even slightly, he has a tendency to correct by
applying full opposite *aileron*, rather than leaving the ailerons neutral
and applying opposite rudder. Thus, the airplane becomes immediately (and very)
uncoordinated.

We had been practicing power-off stalls, and my student was continuing to
apply cross-coordinated applications in an attempt to correct for a slight
wing drop. After I “re-focused” his learning and got him to simply push the
nose over and add a bit of power to recover, he seemed to realize that, as
long as the ball remained centered and the ailerons remained neutral, stalls
(and recovery) were non-events.

Onto power-on stall practice.

On our first power-on stall, I kept my hand firmly on the stick to keep him
from applying any sort of “aileron correction”. Nonetheless, with a very
slight wing drop, he applied full opposing aileron (beyond my ability to
stop it). The airplane rolled into the dropped wing, and then quickly to
the opposite side. And then it went into a spin.

In a millisecond and without thought, my left hand ripped off the CAPS
placard and grabbed the CAPS handle. As I was about to pull the handle, a
thought entered my mind: “WAIT! You are at 5500 AGL with power on. Before
you pull the CAPS, you need to cut the power!”

In the next half-second, my hand reached down to retard the power lever, I
instinctually applied full opposite rudder (I somehow knew we were spinning
left because my student was “below” me to the left), and I pushed hard on
the stick. Again, there seemed to be barely any thought involved; only
instinct based upon training.

As quickly as we had entered the spin, we were recovering. The entire event
took maybe four to six seconds. I believe we made two full turns in the
spin.

After the event, I made the decision to immediately continue to practice
power-on stalls with that student – right then. We spun, we recovered, and
45 seconds later we did another power-on stall.

Lessons learned:

1. Instinct-based-on-good-training works

2. Stall practice is invaluable

3. Spin training is even more invaluable

4. CAPS is a lifesaver, but if you have the altitude, at least TRY
to recover from a spin in a Cirrus. It might work.

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby flyboy2548m » Mon Dec 20, 2010 12:27 pm

http://www.studentpilot.com/interact/fo ... n-a-Cirrus

I have to say I was surprised when the CFI said his immediate reaction was to reach for the chute.
I was more surprised to see SR20s being used for low-time private students, but...
Chief Pilot/ACJ Program Manager, Vandelay Industries, Inc

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PurduePilot
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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby PurduePilot » Mon Dec 20, 2010 10:19 pm

http://www.studentpilot.com/interact/fo ... n-a-Cirrus

I have to say I was surprised when the CFI said his immediate reaction was to reach for the chute.
I was more surprised to see SR20s being used for low-time private students, but...
What won't they think of next? :|

Image

Image

:|

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Sir Gallivant
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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby Sir Gallivant » Mon Dec 20, 2010 10:38 pm

Where is the slot for the coins?
Veni, Vidi, Velcro!

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby Not_Karl » Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:04 pm

Interesting! A Flight Simulator on the left screen and a strategy game on the right one!
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"I think, based on the types of aircraft listed, you're pretty much guaranteed a fiery death."
- Contemporary Poet flyboy2548m to a Foffie.

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby PurduePilot » Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:10 pm

Interesting! A Flight Simulator on the left screen and a strategy game on the right one!
Points to you

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby flyboy2548m » Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:15 pm

Interesting! A Flight Simulator on the left screen and a strategy game on the right one!
Points to you
Does Purdue use them for primary training or for Instrument and up?
Chief Pilot/ACJ Program Manager, Vandelay Industries, Inc

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby PurduePilot » Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:29 pm

Interesting! A Flight Simulator on the left screen and a strategy game on the right one!
Points to you
Does Purdue use them for primary training or for Instrument and up?
They sold the pristine Warriors (as you and I have previously discussed). To my knowledge, the fleet now consists of the Cirruses (Cirri?), a couple of Arrows for complex training, and a couple of Seminoles for multi (plus the Beechjet). I think I heard that the Cirruses are being used for primary and instrument but they're using one of the round-dial planes (maybe the one 172 or maybe they saved one or two of the Warriors--I can't remember) to get the primary students some experience without the computer screen.

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby flyboy2548m » Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:33 pm

They sold the pristine Warriors (as you and I have previously discussed). To my knowledge, the fleet now consists of the Cirruses (Cirri?), a couple of Arrows for complex training, and a couple of Seminoles for multi (plus the Beechjet). I think I heard that the Cirruses are being used for primary and instrument but they're using one of the round-dial planes (maybe the one 172 or maybe they saved one or two of the Warriors--I can't remember) to get the primary students some experience without the computer screen.
Well, the SRs probably aren't the worst choice for a primary trainer, especially if Cirrus sold them cheap enough. My concern is (and this applies not only to the SRs) that you will have yet another generation of pilots who never learned how to fly the wing and not the engine. I know, because that's what happened to me. It wasn't until I had nearly 700 hours that I first flew an airplane that was so underpowered that I had to get a feel for the wing quick and soon. It was a skill I would have been glad to have much earlier.
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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby PurduePilot » Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:42 pm

They sold the pristine Warriors (as you and I have previously discussed). To my knowledge, the fleet now consists of the Cirruses (Cirri?), a couple of Arrows for complex training, and a couple of Seminoles for multi (plus the Beechjet). I think I heard that the Cirruses are being used for primary and instrument but they're using one of the round-dial planes (maybe the one 172 or maybe they saved one or two of the Warriors--I can't remember) to get the primary students some experience without the computer screen.
Well, the SRs probably aren't the worst choice for a primary trainer, especially if Cirrus sold them cheap enough. My concern is (and this applies not only to the SRs) that you will have yet another generation of pilots who never learned how to fly the wing and not the engine. I know, because that's what happened to me. It wasn't until I had nearly 700 hours that I first flew an airplane that was so underpowered that I had to get a feel for the wing quick and soon. It was a skill I would have been glad to have much earlier.
Ever flown a Cherokee 140 with full tanks and 3 adults? 2000 feet doesn't look very long anymore...

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby flyboy2548m » Mon Dec 20, 2010 11:44 pm

Ever flown a Cherokee 140 with full tanks and 3 adults? 2000 feet doesn't look very long anymore...
Negative. Flew a C172 thus loaded from MIC to GRB and back.
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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby Not_Karl » Tue Dec 21, 2010 6:26 am

Where is the slot for the coins?
Next to the iPhone dock.
Junior Janitor, Vandelay Industries, Inc., Environmental Poisoning Assurance department.

"I think, based on the types of aircraft listed, you're pretty much guaranteed a fiery death."
- Contemporary Poet flyboy2548m to a Foffie.

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby 3WE » Sat Feb 19, 2011 11:53 pm

Negative. Flew a C172 thus loaded from MIC to GRB and back.
Apply full power.

Apply gentle back pressure at 55 kts.

Allow the plane to fly itself off the runway.

Adjust attitude to maintain 60 to 70 kts.

After two hours take aspirin to deal with the droning, loud vibrtions.
Commercial Pilot, Vandelay Industries, Inc., Plant Nutrient Division.

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby PurduePilot » Sun Feb 20, 2011 10:01 pm

Ever flown a Cherokee 140 with full tanks and 3 adults? 2000 feet doesn't look very long anymore...
Negative. Flew a C172 thus loaded from MIC to GRB and back.
When was this? They only opened GRB to civilian-use a couple years ago.

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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby flyboy2548m » Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:19 pm

The only GRB I know of is Austin Straubel International Airport at Green Bay, WI. What GRB are you talking about?
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Re: Spin in Cirrus = Reach for the chute

Postby PurduePilot » Thu Feb 24, 2011 2:12 pm

The only GRB I know of is Austin Straubel International Airport at Green Bay, WI. What GRB are you talking about?
Sorry, I get it mixed up sometimes. Gus Grissom Air Reserve Base is abbreviated GRB (Grissom Reserve Base) but the ICAO designator is KGUS.


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