Lion Air Flight 610

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flyboy2548m
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Re: Lion Air Flight 610

Postby flyboy2548m » Fri Nov 30, 2018 3:59 pm

This article is quite uneducated and contain several mistakes and things that he says "we don't know yet" when in fact we do know.
That is unacceptable or at least very disappointing for a professional aviation typist who just retired as a professional pilot after 34 years, especially taken into account that he wrote the article after the preliminary report which contains the answer to many of his questions and contradicts some of his observations.
Unfortunately, it appears retirement removed what little filter he didn't have in the first place.

That's the thing about little men, they will always try to feel big, whatever the means.
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ocelot
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Re: Lion Air Flight 610

Postby ocelot » Sun Dec 02, 2018 5:10 am

Given that it was posted the same day as the preliminary report, it probably predates the preliminary report, as in it was written a day or two earlier so the author hadn't seen the latter yet. The mistakes though... well, maybe a CNN editor put them in. Or maybe not.

This MCAS stuff is all very well (or not) but it's clear that not knowing about it wasn't the trigger: the accident flight shows the system trimming nose down and the pilots trimming nose up in response, right up until the end of the data. So it isn't like it was secretly trimming nose down and they didn't notice. Instead it looks like they got behind it at the end and it's not at all clear why.

Clearly we need the CVR, and it boggles slightly that it still hasn't been found.

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J
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Re: Lion Air Flight 610

Postby J » Thu Jan 17, 2019 12:22 pm

The cockpit voice recorder (CVR) of the Lion Air Boeing 737 MAX that crashed in the Java Sea in October was recovered by Indonesian Navy divers Jan. 14.

Divers discovered the CVR buried under 26 feet of mud in the Java sea, according to an update on the search published by the Indonesian Navy’s information service. The CVR was discovered within 165 feet of where the 737’s flight data recorder was recovered in November. Indonesia first assigned the naval divers to the search Jan. 8, a few days after Lion Air ended its own search for the CVR.
Monday’s discovery could provide key details explaining what happened on flight JT610 Oct. 29, when the aircraft crashed shortly after taking off from Jakarta. Accident investigators will now review audio from the CVR to understand how the Lion Air pilots were responding to activation of an automatic trim system that was activated as a result of receiving erroneous angle of attack information.

Ridwan Djamaluddin, an Indonesian deputy maritime minister, told reporters that remains of some of the people who died in the crash were also discovered at the seabed location, according to the Associated Press. The recorder has been transported to Jakarta, where officials from the National Transportation Safety Committee (NTSC) will dry and clean the device before attempting to download its data for review.

Flight JT610 was the first crash of the Boeing 737 MAX, which entered into commercial service in May 2017. The Lion Air 737 MAX 8 that crashed first started flying for the airline in August registered as PK-LPQ. It was equipped with a CVR manufactured by L3 Technologies featuring a 90-day underwater locator beacon. ICAO first adopted the 90-day international airworthiness standard for underwater locator beacons on commercial aircraft in July 2016 in response to the March 2014 disappearance of Malaysian Airlines flight 370.

A preliminary report published by NTSC in November noted the 737’s nose pointed down 26 times on the 11-minute flight while pilots manually attempted to point the nose higher. FDR data showed how the airline’s pilots struggled to maintain control of the maneuvering characteristics augmentation system (MCAS), which has come under scrutiny following the crash.

The MCAS is designed to automatically command the aircraft’s nose-down stabilizer to enhance pitch characteristics when entering steep turns with elevated load factors that can lead to a stall, according to Boeing. It becomes deactivated once the angle of attack falls below the threshold or when manual stabilizer commands are input by the flight crew.

A review of the cockpit voice recordings could tell the investigators why they were reacting to the MCAS system in a way that ultimately lead to the crash. The FAA has already published an airworthiness directive requiring a Boeing 737 MAX flight operations manual update as a result of the ongoing investigation.
https://www.aviationtoday.com/2019/01/ ... 7-max-cvr/

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Gabriel
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Re: Lion Air Flight 610

Postby Gabriel » Sat Oct 26, 2019 1:32 am

https://boeing.mediaroom.com/2019-10-25 ... nal-Report

CHICAGO, Oct. 25, 2019 /PRNewswire/ -- Boeing (NYSE: BA) issued the following statement regarding the release today of the final investigation report of Lion Air Flight 610 by Indonesia's National Transportation Safety Committee (KNKT):

"On behalf of everyone at Boeing, I want to convey our heartfelt condolences to the families and loved ones of those who lost their lives in these accidents. We mourn with Lion Air, and we would like to express our deepest sympathies to the Lion Air family," said Boeing President & CEO Dennis Muilenburg. "These tragic events have deeply affected us all and we will always remember what happened."

"We commend Indonesia's National Transportation Safety Committee for its extensive efforts to determine the facts of this accident, the contributing factors to its cause and recommendations aimed toward our common goal that this never happens again."

"We are addressing the KNKT's safety recommendations, and taking actions to enhance the safety of the 737 MAX to prevent the flight control conditions that occurred in this accident from ever happening again. Safety is an enduring value for everyone at Boeing and the safety of the flying public, our customers, and the crews aboard our airplanes is always our top priority. We value our long-standing partnership with Lion Air and we look forward to continuing to work together in the future."

Boeing experts, working as technical advisors to the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board, have supported the KNKT over the course of the investigation. The company's engineers have been working with the US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) and other global regulators to make software updates and other changes, taking into account the information from the KNKT's investigation.

Since this accident, the 737 MAX and its software are undergoing an unprecedented level of global regulatory oversight, testing and analysis. This includes hundreds of simulator sessions and test flights, regulatory analysis of thousands of documents, reviews by regulators and independent experts and extensive certification requirements.

Over the past several months Boeing has been making changes to the 737 MAX. Most significantly, Boeing has redesigned the way Angle of Attack (AoA) sensors work with a feature of the flight control software known as Maneuvering Characteristics Augmentation System (MCAS). Going forward, MCAS will compare information from both AoA sensors before activating, adding a new layer of protection.

In addition, MCAS will now only turn on if both AoA sensors agree, will only activate once in response to erroneous AOA, and will always be subject to a maximum limit that can be overridden with the control column.

These software changes will prevent the flight control conditions that occurred in this accident from ever happening again.

In addition, Boeing is updating crew manuals and pilot training, designed to ensure every pilot has all of the information they need to fly the 737 MAX safely.

Boeing continues to work with the FAA and other regulatory agencies worldwide on the certification of the software update and training program to safely return the 737 MAX to service.

(And yes, it's a double post)

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3WE
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Re: Lion Air Flight 610

Postby 3WE » Sat Nov 02, 2019 11:04 pm

I feel like we should be doing something, or at least ranting about Wall Street, greed, human nature, and the fact that sometimes, excrement transpires.
Commercial Pilot, Vandelay Industries, Inc., Plant Nutrient Division.

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Not_Karl
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Re: Lion Air Flight 610

Postby Not_Karl » Sun Nov 03, 2019 8:15 am

I feel like we should be doing something, or at least ranting about Wall Street, greed, human nature, and the fact that sometimes, excrement transpires.
And asking for curtains.
International Ban ALL Aeroplanies Association, founder and president.

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ocelot
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Re: Lion Air Flight 610

Postby ocelot » Sat Nov 09, 2019 8:42 pm

There was a magazine article making the rounds on the internets about a month ago to this effect. Unfortunately, in its zeal to rip Boeing management a new one it sacrificed some measure of technical accuracy. Interesting read nonetheless, perhaps.

if you can't find it I can try to dig up a link...


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