Don't practice touch and goes on a golf course.

[3WE]

***Some anonymous person who claimed to be familiar with the situation mentioned in the comments section that she was definitely not ready and shouldn't have been in that situation.***

I am not_familiar with the situation, but it does appear she may not have been ready.

-Suspicious looking XC
-Landing downwind
-Evidence of fear on radio
-Botched go-around

I'll stop short of being Evan and demanding CHANGES in training, but in a perfect world, someone should be competent and comfortable with a LOT OF STUFF before being allowed to solo:

-How to do a go-around [and retract flaps] (without relentlessly pulling up and losing control)
-How to SEAMLESSLY shift to a backup navigation plan if you are "lost"
-Some competence with engine failure and emergency landings

Maybe you don't solo until you have 20 hours and you don't do solo XC until 30 hours- plus you demonstrate the ability to change plans and deal with stuff with minimal sweat?

/meaningless fluff.

[KPryor]

Completely agree. It's not hard to see that she had no business being in that situation and I'd hate to be the instructor that allowed her to get herself killed. I have to wonder if said instructor was under any kind of pressure to get her in the air. Her death has brought about attention from the state governor and various other notables. Her dad is a city councilman there and she's been quite active in the community.
I read a lot of GA crash reports because I find them interesting. Usually it's known flight into IMC and other totally avoidable things. This crash really stood out to me because she was clearly not someone that should have been in that airplane alone that day (or maybe ever).

[Gabriel]

There is a potential psychological situation here: One can never know for sure how one person will react on their first solo, or in their first emergency, or in their first abnormal situation.

You can simulate all the emergencies you want, you can tell the student "pretend that I am not here, I am not going to speak to you or take action unless we are about to die", but the student knows that it is a simulated situation.

In a first cross-country flight, something goes a little bit wrong (like you can't find that bridge that you took as waypoint) and it can start cascading in a psychological situation that may end in panic, confusion, task saturation, and etcetera.

I had a couple of cases of that myself, not so serious but in that direction.

[3WE]

There is a potential psychological situation here: One can never know for sure how one person will react on their first solo, or in their first emergency, or in their first abnormal situation.

…...

I had a couple of cases of that myself, not so serious but in that direction.

Me too.

In hindsight, it might not have hurt to have a few more hours and competencies and simulations with teach' on board.

I agree you can't know how someone will handle stress. Conversely, I knew how to tune the magic VOR, AND follow highways AND HOW NOT TO STALL OUT OF A GO-AROUND.

Can't say with 100% certainty, but the poor gal seemed high (or average) on hours and weak on fundamental competencies.

[KPryor]

It looks like there were storms in the area when she took off. May have gotten a little rattled flying in that too. It's hard to tell exactly where the storms were at the time of takeoff since the weather radar depiction on the Flightaware page doesn't update as you run the flight track loop. Still, they couldn't have been terribly far off as she was leaving. Another sign of bad decision making if she took off with thunderstorms anywhere near the area.

[3WE]

If there’s a FlightAware track, that would mean she had an assigned transponder code AND would be using flight following...correct?

That would be “good judgment” and hopefully of some help?

There ought to be some insight from ATC?

Or she got the code, but stopped talking to them...

[KPryor]

She had filed a VFR flight plan. Unknown to me if she had flight following or not. The FAA called the airport looking for her just prior to the crash.

A local Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) air traffic control center called a few minutes before the landing attempt and was looking for the airplane. A co-worker hung up with the center and then called 9-1-1 notifying them of the crash.

[3WE]

She had filed a VFR flight plan.

I don’t think that gets you a transponder code, so I don’t THINK FlightAware can identify you for tracking. I have no idea how many folks would be squawking VFR and how FlightAware or ATC would sort out who’s who.

Flight following would give you a discrete code...

Shit- it just hit me that there’s all that new ADSB stuff, so maybe I’m wrong on this line of thinking.

[KPryor]

Yep, ADS-B. I run an ADS-B receiver that sends data to Flightaware and also to the Opensky Network. My receiver picks up all kinds of aircraft squawking 1200.

[3WE]

It looks like there were storms in the area when she took off...…. It's hard to tell exactly where the storms were at the time of takeoff since the weather radar depiction on the Flightaware page doesn't update as you run the flight track loop.

Based on storm movement and other Flightaware depictions she may have flown around that cell shortly after takeoff to cause that first 'odd' track.

Another question is if the plane had a magenta line generator.

[KPryor]

Based on storm movement and other Flightaware depictions she may have flown around that cell shortly after takeoff to cause that first 'odd' track.[/quote.]
That very well may be. It would make sense, but if it was that close I would think a student pilot probably shouldn't have flying in the first place (just my humble and unqualified opinion).

Just for the heck of it, I loaded up X-Plane last night at KGTR. I used ActiveSky XP historical weather to provide the weather as it was on the date and time of her departure. ActiveSky does a pretty decent job of recreating correct weather. I'm sure it's not perfect, but I think it's normally pretty good. Anyway, if (and again I say IF) it was accurate, there was thunder and lightning in the area prior to takeoff. I haven't found another real world source for the METAR as of that date and time, but the one produced AS from it's historical records definitely showed storms close enough that I can't imagine a student pilot should have been starting a flight near. I'm not saying any of this had a direct cause/effect on the crash, but a scary flight from point A to B could have influenced her performance on arrival perhaps. When I get some time, I'm going to try to semi-accurately recreate her flight path as close as possible with the AS weather and see what I can see.

Another question is if the plane had a magenta line generator.

No idea, but I figure CAP planes probably have them.

[KPryor]

By the way, if my "test" in X-Plane seemed too dumb or simplistic, my apologies. I just kinda wanted to see what the weather might have been like throughout the flight and this is the only way I have at the moment to even come close. With the help of a friend, I now have a way to recreate the exact flight path in XP from right after takeoff until just before her landing attempt. I'm going to fly it later just for the heck of it.
Not sure why, but I'm just really interested in this crash for some reason.

[flyboy2548m]

Yea, the glamour shot definitely makes you wonder, but it's far from proof she wasn't serious about learning to fly.

Perhaps not, but neither does it prove that she WAS serious. Another "airperson" who had numerous glamour shots taken of herself in full uniform was the UPS F/O in the Birmingham incident. Incidentally, she was completely out of uniform compliance in those shots (hair was about three miles past the collar).

[KPryor]

I keep seeing over and over that she was practicing touch and goes, but I don't know where that came from. There's nothing about that in the NTSB preliminary report, but it's in various news reports. Wondering if she really was trying to do that or if she was actually trying to make a full stop landing.

[3WE]

I keep seeing over and over that she was practicing touch and goes, but I don't know where that came from. There's nothing about that in the NTSB preliminary report, but it's in various news reports. Wondering if she really was trying to do that or if she was actually trying to make a full stop landing.

I don't think that's significant and have this theory- An eyewitness observed an approach followed by a climb out and assumed it was a touch and go. He reported it to the media and they fixated on it/copy paste/whatever.

It's POSSIBLE to end an XC and shoot a touch and go, but with that being 'prohibited' by policy and insurance, and some of the other evidence, it seems unlikely that touch and go was the intent.

[KPryor]

A commenter claiming to be this girls father posted on the accident page at Kathryn's Report.

David Little said...

Interesting to read a few of these comments as well as disappointing at the speculation. Nothing will bring my daughter back be it pilot error or mechanical issues. She had a great flight instructor who is active USAF for twenty and trains pilots currently at Columbus AFB. CAP does not allow touch and goes without the instructor and required to do stop and goes without the instructor. She never landed this plane. She was to take her check ride four days after this accident. Signed, a broken hearted father.
Monday, August 5, 2019 at 2:28:00 PM EDT