'Nother one bites the dust

Discussion of aviation issues which are not safety related (airline operations, pilot contracts, aviation industry news, etc.)

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RadarContactLost
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'Nother one bites the dust

Postby RadarContactLost » Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:26 pm

Gemini Air Cargo stop operating today. Anyone need some DC-10s (I've heard all the MD-11s were leased.)
You're not a Freight Dawg unless you've shot the ILS to 23L at KYIP in a transport category aircraft no longer used in passenger service. You're OG if it had a tailwheel or BMEP gauges.

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Cam
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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Cam » Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:38 am

Well, on another thread they were talking about the 77F...who is going to be left to buy those?

Pack up Boeing, they've had it.
You should all know by now....so please stop asking.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby David Hilditch » Thu Aug 28, 2008 7:30 pm

Now Zoom Airlines is out.

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Cam
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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Cam » Thu Aug 28, 2008 8:04 pm

Another kick in the face for the airline industry.
You should all know by now....so please stop asking.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby David Hilditch » Thu Aug 28, 2008 8:51 pm

Another kick in the face for the airline industry.
In what way is it a kick in the face for the airline industry ?

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Cam
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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Cam » Fri Aug 29, 2008 1:28 am

Another kick in the face for the airline industry.
In what way is it a kick in the face for the airline industry ?
It just is David, it just is.
You should all know by now....so please stop asking.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby flyboy2548m » Fri Aug 29, 2008 2:02 am

In what way is it a kick in the face for the airline industry ?
Well, for one thing, it means our old friend JetCaptain is now out of a job, something I wouldn't wish on anybody. Well, that's not true, there are people I would wish it upon, but he's not one of them
"Lav sinks on 737 Max are too small"

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby el » Fri Aug 29, 2008 7:27 am

Now Zoom Airlines is out.
http://www.flyzoom.com/

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby David Hilditch » Fri Sep 12, 2008 2:45 am

Two more European airlines down in the past 5 days : Futura and XL Airways (the former Excel).

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Robert Hilton
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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Robert Hilton » Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:20 am

Two more European airlines down in the past 5 days : Futura and XL Airways (the former Excel).
Wasn't Excel involved in a drugs money laundering scandal in the past?

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Procede » Fri Sep 12, 2008 8:26 am

Wasn't Excel involved in a drugs money laundering scandal in the past?
Wasn't that Air Holland / ExelAviationGroup?

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby David Hilditch » Fri Sep 12, 2008 10:43 am

Wasn't Excel involved in a drugs money laundering scandal in the past?
Wasn't that Air Holland / ExelAviationGroup?
It was Air Holland - what happened to them - they collapsed in the end, but they went through some new identities first..? As for XL/Excel, this is quite a big collapse, but the group had some odd features. It remains to be seen whether the French and German airlines in the group continue or not.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Procede » Fri Sep 12, 2008 3:23 pm

It was Air Holland - what happened to them - they collapsed in the end, but they went through some new identities first..? As for XL/Excel, this is quite a big collapse, but the group had some odd features. It remains to be seen whether the French and German airlines in the group continue or not.
Air Holland became HollandExel (xel Aviation Group), which went bankrupt a year later and is now basically ArkeFly (TUI Group). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arkefly

ArkeFly was in a bit of trouble this week as they were leasing two Futura 737-900s, which were grounded.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Schorsch » Fri Sep 12, 2008 3:49 pm

From basic theory for a herd of animals the optimum way to get most through the winter is when lots of them die early. The remaining can then survive on the scarce resources. If - for any reason - more animals stay in business, each individual does not get enough food and the whole herd might starve.

In worst case, the demand for air travel decreases by 5%. So, that is one out of 20 aircraft less. When you look at Atlanta airport, you wouldn't even notice the difference. But if the capacity isn't cut back and some airlines go out of business, the 5% lesser demand might suffice to have all airlines in the red.

Therefore: Let's greet all the bankrupt airlines, they didn't die for nothing.



P.S.: you never wanna be the one that dies early, you never want to be the tank going over the ridge first, or have the honor to be in the first boat that lands at Omaha beach
Publicly, we say one thing... Actually, we do another.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby David Hilditch » Fri Sep 12, 2008 3:58 pm

From basic theory for a herd of animals the optimum way to get most through the winter is when lots of them die early. The remaining can then survive on the scarce resources. If - for any reason - more animals stay in business, each individual does not get enough food and the whole herd might starve.
I'm not a zoologist, but I have been a watcher of the airline industry for 40 years. I can tell you that the worst time of the year (especially for European airlines, oddly) when failures have historically been most common is the spring/end of the winter. The main reason for this is that it is the time of year when airlines are gearing up for the summer and they need more cash flow to finance this, yet the previous months have been through the winter when cash flow is at its weakest.

There may be other factors at work in this recession, notably fuel costs, but the worst may still be to come.

Procede - many thanks.

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Robert Hilton
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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Robert Hilton » Fri Sep 12, 2008 6:59 pm

Wasn't Excel involved in a drugs money laundering scandal in the past?
Wasn't that Air Holland / ExelAviationGroup?
Indeed Procede, my bad.

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el
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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby el » Fri Sep 12, 2008 7:19 pm

Anyone knows what's going on with SkyEurope? One of their planes seems to be impounded in MAN (or so the rumours go). Next one to go bust :?:

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el
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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby el » Fri Sep 12, 2008 7:22 pm

An article from a few days ago.
Struggling SkyEurope suffers deepening losses
Monday September 1, 2008

SkyEurope Airlines suffered a €16.8 million ($24.8 million) loss in the fiscal third quarter ended June 30, widened from a €5.1 million deficit in the year-ago quarter, as high fuel prices offset the company's continuing efforts to cut costs and streamline its operation.

The airline said it responded by raising fares and cutting capacity in addition to eliminating "poor performing" routes (ATWOnline, July 23), but revenue rose just 0.1% year-over-year to €67.9 million and EBIT declined to a €14 million loss from the €5.2 million lost in the year-ago quarter.
more & source: http://atwonline.com/news/story.html?storyID=13868

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby B77W-QOTS » Wed Oct 08, 2008 10:36 am

"We are running an airline not a circus," - Qantas spokeswoman

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby David Hilditch » Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:46 pm

LTE International today.

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Peminu
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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby Peminu » Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:06 pm

And now Aladia in Mexico (I believe it is the seventh this year in Mexico).

Four 757's...Could it be the problem to service the engines the final drop?

Hmm...What kind of engines has Obama's plane?
Just another cast away from AD.com that reached AD.info island.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby David Hilditch » Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:57 pm

Hmm...What kind of engines has Obama's plane?
Rolls-Royce. It's a North American Airlines airframe.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby David Hilditch » Wed Oct 29, 2008 9:52 am

Sterling Airways of Denmark is this week's failure.

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby B77W-QOTS » Wed Oct 29, 2008 12:42 pm

"We are running an airline not a circus," - Qantas spokeswoman

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Re: 'Nother one bites the dust

Postby IntheShade » Wed Oct 29, 2008 1:53 pm

Sterling Airways of Denmark is this week's failure.
I would also like to nominate Glenn.
Aviation Pilot, Author, Genius


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