737 End-of-flight structural break-up.

[3WE]

Southwest loses nose gear in New Yark 7-20-2013.

7-23-2013, the morning news is using the words "hard landing".

And now for a really tough question...

The passengers were told to sit tight for a few minutes and not evacuate while the cabin "filled" with smoke.

It would appear that this was right decision- everyone got out in what was probably? an orderly evacuation

...however, with the tendency for planes to burn up and have minimal evacuation times...If I was by a window exit, I might just pull it and to hell with what the crew wants.

And yes, my actions could result in injuries from a panicked evacuation...but weigh the risks. The Delta 727 engine stall at DFW, 13 folks died before they could evacuate.

...and yes, this is speculative, arm-chair, parlour talk about a crash with no deaths.

[OldSowBreath]

After repeated viewings of the video, it appears that the nose gear collapsed upon landing, and the aircraft skidded at least 2,000 ft down the runway.

[3WE]

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=2ec_1374546266

I am impressed with the gentleness.

[Dummy Pilot]

The Southwest Airlines plane whose nose gear collapsed while landing at New York's LaGuardia Airport touched down nose-first, federal investigators announced Thursday.

The National Transportation Safety Board, which investigates crashes, had earlier said that the Boeing 737-700's nose gear punched up into the jet's electronics bay in the crash Monday.

Planes typically touch down first with the main landing gear beneath the wings, before having the nose settle. Investigators said the plane's nose was still pitched upward slightly — 2 degrees — four seconds before landing, but then touched down while pitched downward 3 degrees

USA Today Link

[ocelot]

Southwest loses nose gear in New Yark 7-20-2013.
...however, with the tendency for planes to burn up and have minimal evacuation times...If I was by a window exit, I might just pull it and to hell with what the crew wants.

Doing that while the engines are still running would not be ... entirely clever.

[Not_Karl]

Southwest loses nose gear in New Yark 7-20-2013.
...however, with the tendency for planes to burn up and have minimal evacuation times...If I was by a window exit, I might just pull it and to hell with what the crew wants.

Doing that while the engines are still running would not be ... entirely clever.

Indeed.
I would push another person first and see what happens.

[GlennAB1]

Southwest loses nose gear in New Yark 7-20-2013.
...however, with the tendency for planes to burn up and have minimal evacuation times...If I was by a window exit, I might just pull it and to hell with what the crew wants.

Doing that while the engines are still running would not be ... entirely clever.

Pfffttttt, on a 737... after crash landing with flaps extended... I'd be out the overwing exit and aft down the flaps so fast I wouldn't have even heard anyone say anything.

[3WE]

Southwest loses nose gear in New Yark 7-20-2013.
...however, with the tendency for planes to burn up and have minimal evacuation times...If I was by a window exit, I might just pull it and to hell with what the crew wants.

Doing that while the engines are still running would not be ... entirely clever.

Pfffttttt, on a 737... after crash landing with flaps extended... I'd be out the overwing exit and aft down the flaps so fast I wouldn't have even heard anyone say anything.

Indeed...Just before I photograph my drink and empty peanut sack, I always read the safety card which depicts a big red X by the engine inake and a big green arrow showing to head aft and slide down the flaps...

...I think you are supposed to hold your hands upward and shout whoopeeeee!

[reubee]

Southwest loses nose gear in New Yark 7-20-2013.
...however, with the tendency for planes to burn up and have minimal evacuation times...If I was by a window exit, I might just pull it and to hell with what the crew wants.

Doing that while the engines are still running would not be ... entirely clever.

Pfffttttt, on a 737... after crash landing with flaps extended... I'd be out the overwing exit and aft down the flaps so fast I wouldn't have even heard anyone say anything.

With the nose sitting on the ground, when you get out the overwing exit is your instinct telling you to go uphill or to go downhill? Probably why they have those big arrows painted on top of the wing pointing you up away from the engine inlet.

[OldSowBreath]

I suggest tossing one of those annoying, crying babies off the wing first to ascertain engine thrust velocity. Your usual overweight pax is not sufficient to give you a good feel for your potential landing zone.

[Gabriel]

The best line of the article:

In a case of very unfortunate timing, travellers signed up to a Qantas mailing list reported receiving an email on Friday morning advertising discounted flights to Santiago.

That's professional journalism, right? Everybody knows that "traveler" takes one L, not two.

[ocelot]

It is a valid spelling on the other side of the pond.

[Gabriel]

It is a valid spelling on the other side of the pond.

Well, that depends on which side you are.
It's an USA Today article, so I guess it's from "this" side, not "the other" one.

Yet, my final comment was just a joke, the reason for that sentence NOT being a good piece of journalism in NOT the number of Ls in a word.

[ocelot]

Yes, well, if it's a USA Today article "journalism" doesn't really play a role either...

[Gabriel]

USA Today... "journalism" doesn't really play a role.

Point made.

[Dummy Pilot]

NTSB Report, CVR, FDR, Human performance, etc.

Southwest 345

Short version....Captain with history of CRM issues takes controls <100ft and touches down at 3.2gs.

[flyboy2548m]

I understand, she (yes, SHE) has a no-fly list longer than 16R in Denver.

[3WE]

NTSB Report, CVR, FDR, Human performance, etc.

Southwest 345

Short version....Captain with history of PMS issues takes controls <100ft and touches down at 3.2gs.

Fixed?

[ocelot]

That kind of remark is highly inappropriate. This has been pointed out to you before.

[3WE]

Ossie:

Apologies if I offended you or someone. This place has traditionally had a fair bit of sarcastic, non-PC humor, which I thought we enjoyed.

FWIW- I encouraged my daughter to pursue aviation; however her interests were elsewhere.

If Monch (or you) wish that my post be deleted- he's welcome to- however, I cannot due to the set up of this forum.

AND, If you want to go serious, I'll go to OT and talk about the interesting male vs female behavior of how the daughters friends reacted to my toy yoke and MSFS...there's some truth behind stereotypes (and that's not saying you can block a qualified person from flying a plane if they want to).

[ocelot]

I'm not trying to call you a bad person (I'll leave that to Flyboy) so don't feel you have to defend yourself -- that isn't the point. It's more that remarks of that type insult/demean people quite broadly.

In this environment (a message board on the internet where the posting community is or appears to be overwhelmingly male, connected to a male-dominated industry) any woman passing by and reading that remark is likely to feel personally targeted. So... if you meant to demean all women, you were probably successful; but I doubt you did. If you didn't... be aware of the blast radius you're creating.

One might think that everyone knows that remarks about PMS (or whatever) obviously apply to only a handful of women (who you might be willing to offend) or to no real women at all as it's a stereotypical concept with only limited grounding in reality. And there are contexts where that's true. (Not as many as you might think, though, and it's difficult to carry off if you appear to be male because you're speaking from an out-group rather than the in-group.) However, in this context there are essentially no visible women, or at most very few: so the only identifying characteristic needed is "female", and thus anything that applies to any woman, even a mythical/chimerical one, will tend to be interpreted as applying to all women. And thus any women passersby will tend to feel attacked. Observing that this makes no sense and that any given specific person shouldn't feel attacked doesn't help; they do, that's how the social dynamic works. The long-term way to fix this is to make the environment more inclusive (because then "female" ceases to be a meaningful identifying characteristic in the social environment, and people stop being identified by it) but in order to do that everyone has to first avoid these kinds of remarks. (Regardless of whether they're otherwise funny, unfortunately.)

It doesn't help that there's a long history of sexist/misogynistic and harassing comments being used to exclude women from men-only social contexts.

Anyhow, the only real connection this has with "non-PC" is that the leftist social movement that eventually got labeled "political correctness" started out as a well-intentioned attempt to avoid being nasty to people. Well, that and the term "non-PC" is often used by blowhards as a blanket excuse for overt sexism or racism.

If you want to talk about gender politics, I think the Political Discussion Forum is the place. Caution: failure to handle these topics in accord with SOPs for internet discussions can lead to dangerous emissions of hot air.

[flyboy2548m]

In this environment (a message board on the internet where the posting community is or appears to be overwhelmingly male, connected to a male-dominated industry) any woman passing by and reading that remark is likely to feel personally targeted...

That would be her personal problem, wouldn't it? Or is your point that being female entitles someone to never have their feelings hurt? (not that that stance would be unique to you)

[ocelot]

Yes, yes it is... if you really mean to be insulting half the planet. Maybe you do; 3WE probably doesn't.

[flyboy2548m]

Yes, yes it is... if you really mean to be insulting half the planet. Maybe you do; 3WE probably doesn't.

I'm not sure which is more insulting, what 3BS wrote or your seeming assumption that "half the planet" has the IQ of 20 and has no reading comprehension beyond the surface. I'd like to think that were I a woman, I'd find the latter far more demeaning.

[Verbal]

I'd like to think that were I a woman, I'd find the latter far more demeaning.

If I were a woman, I would sit around and play with my breasts all day.