Good landing 10-19-2021

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3WE
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Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby 3WE » Tue Oct 19, 2021 5:20 pm

Crash and burn, but no did-diedness from 21 occupants! :clap:

Disclaimer- can’t say for sure if everyone walked away.

However, a big expensive aeroplanie will cause much paperwork.

Unfortunately Gabriel, 3BS, and Evan were not there to help.

Ban all airplanes!

Text says DC-9-87. The tail looks right, but the smoking hole looks small.

https://www.fox26houston.com/news/plane ... ler-county
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby flyboy2548m » Tue Oct 19, 2021 6:17 pm

What the hell paint scheme is that?
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3WE
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby 3WE » Tue Oct 19, 2021 6:28 pm

With 21 persons, I ass-ume some sort of big-ass, used, converted, economical, corporate jet, with God-knows-whatever paint job the CEO’s wife chose.

Additional detail- this is just off the departure end of a smallish-looking airport and most likely a takeoff (not_landing).
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Gabriel
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby Gabriel » Tue Oct 19, 2021 8:24 pm

The aircraft has been identified as a McDonnell Douglas MD-87, which has fixed wings and two engines. It is registered to 987 Investments LLC.
https://www.google.com/search?q=N987AK& ... =912&dpr=1

https://registry.faa.gov/AircraftInquir ... rTxt=987AK

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Gabriel
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby Gabriel » Tue Oct 19, 2021 8:34 pm

With 21 persons, I ass-ume some sort of big-ass, used, converted, economical, corporate jet, with God-knows-whatever paint job the CEO’s wife chose.

Additional detail- this is just off the departure end of a smallish-looking airport and most likely a takeoff (not_landing).
6600 ft, not particularly long at all. Only 21 on board so no much weight in homo-cargo. But Houston to Boston is not a short flight either so probably lots of fuel.

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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby elaw » Wed Oct 20, 2021 2:04 am

Semi-interesting audio of news helicopters having a feeding frenzy in the Delta airspace near the airport: https://youtu.be/ids2Njd1sl8
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3WE
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby 3WE » Wed Oct 20, 2021 2:05 am

6600 ft, not particularly long at all.
Conversely, it is rather adequate for normal operations.
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby 3WE » Thu Oct 21, 2021 12:45 am

Gossip at Katherine’s report (paraphrased):

The PF was pulling up relentlessly, but the plane did not_rotate.

It would appear to be a save due to adherence to V3BS
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby elaw » Thu Oct 21, 2021 2:03 am

What the hell paint scheme is that?
It's a distinctive set of colors and patterns typically used to denote the owner of an aircraft, but that's not important right now.
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3WE
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby 3WE » Thu Oct 21, 2021 3:25 am

What the hell paint scheme is that?
It's a distinctive set of colors and patterns typically used to denote the owner of an aircraft, but that's not important right now.
Its a pretty blue color and looks like a Tylenol PM.
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J
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby J » Thu Oct 21, 2021 8:08 pm

The following news video supposedly shows the aircraft starting its takeoff roll. At 17 seconds you can see a puff of smoke from one of the engines.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1wOr8CH0FRs


Here are some of the comments:

16 hours ago:
Compressor stall is incorrect. There are several bleed valves which change position during engine acceleration. That puff of smoke indicates a variation in fuel/air ratio during acceleration. A bleed valve needs to be cleaned and/or lubricated.

18 hours ago
Pilot advanced the throttles too quickly, stalled the compressor and STILL tried to take off. Total incompetence on behalf of the flight deck. Pilot error all around. Perfect case of "getthereitis" because the boss was onboard.

19 hours ago
Compressor stall. Pilots should have aborted and RTO'd but they kept trying to accelerate and get the plane to fly. Some have been saying the aircraft actually made it into the air but ariel views of the wheel tracks into the field show that it ran off the runway and collapsed the main gear. Another thing is notice the burning aircraft and looking at the engines that the reverse thrust buckets were not deployed. Total pilot error. Thank God everyone made it out. Had the plane actually made it into the air and then impacted the ground with full fuel, it could have been a much different story. Its a reminder to love those you are with while you can.

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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby J » Thu Oct 21, 2021 10:17 pm

NTSB Briefing can be found here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T82CmOd_ucU

Summary:
  • NTSB is reviewing the video of smoke puff
    Engines are in pretty good shape
    First flight of the plane since December 2020
    Tire marks indicate hard braking - all tires were contacting the runway when departing the runway.
    No debris on runway or on ground ahead of final resting space
    Interviewing the crew
    Flight mechanic who on flight opened the main cabin door after the plane came to rest, slides deployed and everyone exited.
    Cockpit Voice Recorder appears in good condition.
    Flight Data Recorder is an older type with magnetic tape - appears not to have suffered heat damage. Investigators continue to examine. We don't yet know how many parameters the device recorded.
Question: did plane get off the ground? We are still analyzing the data. Heavy braking suggests an aborted takeoff
Question 1200 feet of heavy braking markings? Yes We also have distinct wheel marks from all three landing gear impressions in the grass No indications of fire until left wing contacted a row of trees.
Question: condition of the engines? Answer: Both are in great condition considering what they went through. We are getting good information from them. We aren't going to make any conclusions about their performance at this early time in the investigation.

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Gabriel
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby Gabriel » Fri Oct 22, 2021 1:34 am


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elaw
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby elaw » Fri Oct 22, 2021 11:40 am

Yeah I saw that video last night. Did you see the part where he points out that based on burn marks in the grass, apparently only one engine was making power? The burn pattern would also support the thinking that the reverser(s) was not deployed, at least at the moment the plane came to rest.
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3WE
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby 3WE » Fri Oct 22, 2021 3:20 pm


Summary:
***
First flight of the plane since December 2020
***
Which hints that it might be the first MD-80 flight for the pilots since December 2020 (or a number of variants) they could be rusty too.
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Gabriel
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby Gabriel » Fri Oct 22, 2021 6:40 pm

Yeah I saw that video last night. Did you see the part where he points out that based on burn marks in the grass, apparently only one engine was making power?

Yes, but that is not conclusive. The plane was quite damaged by when it stopped. Perhaps the fuel lines to #1 were severed or #1 itself was damaged and the engine stopped working. Perhaps the pilots shot down the engines but it didn't work for #2 because some cable or something else was severed.
The burn pattern would also support the thinking that the reverser(s) was not deployed, at least at the moment the plane came to rest.
Yes, and the reverser buckets themselves where not deployed either. Again, "the reversers were never deployed" is not the only possible explanation for this.

What called my attention is that the brake skid marks start so late, just some hundreds of feet before the end of the runway.
Combining that with a comment allegedly done by the pilot that the plane "would not rotate", perhaps they kept trying to make it lift-off until they were very close to the end of the runway.

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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby 3WE » Sun Oct 31, 2021 12:42 pm

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J
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby J » Fri Nov 12, 2021 9:18 pm

Preliminary NTSB report - jammed elevator prevented rotation. Apparently control tabs can feel fine when the crew move the yokes forward and back but will jam up when the elevators are under aerodynamic load.

https://youtu.be/UTUPGUB8bKQ

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Gabriel
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby Gabriel » Sat Nov 13, 2021 12:18 am

And this is the preliminary report (or rather an update, the NTSB is not calling it a report):

https://www.ntsb.gov/investigations/Pag ... MA009.aspx

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3WE
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Re: Good landing 10-19-2021

Postby 3WE » Sun Nov 14, 2021 9:55 pm

So some ass-umption that the pilots did things ok…Evanie hinting that there’s no practical inspection of stabilizer freedom (and no real way to do it on a preflight walk-around.

And snarcasm + truth, the pilots seemed pretty OK in aborting at V-3BS.
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